RG-16 Problem

Wow, 3+ years later and I have come back to this

So, I have completely simplified.
Nevermind the squealing for now, just baby steps.

I tried PreAmp cabled directly to Power Amp.
My TriAxis has electrical noise, for sure.
Guitar processing is lovely, electrical noise not so nice. So there is that to troubleshoot.
Previous owner might have been using Monster cable as the output jack has a lot of play. I do have a Monster cable with which I can check to verify.

Then I tried RG-16 loop 1:
cable1_RG-16 front panel input>
cable2_from front>Input>
cable3_RG-16 Send 1>TriAxis Input>
cable4_TriAxis Output (upper)>RG-16 Return 1>
cable5_RG-16 Output (under Tuner Out socket)>power amp in

When the loop is switched off, RG-16 is still passing audio. Is that supposed to happen?
Manual says "The audio signal passes through unchanged." OK, if this is the case, then I have been misunderstanding all along. Looks like I need to try loops 5-8. I understand now; loops 1-4 are for before the preAmp stage.

I'm going to log my troubleshooting here if that's OK. :)
 
Coalface said:
Hi Todd/Ron,

Is this a ground loop issue? That can cause squealing when there is a lot of gain involved. Think of your ground plain in the system like a party balloon. As the currents and things get higher, it will burst.

The way you it seems have it, you're sending the tip/sleeve connections back and forth to the RG-16 several times, interconnecting several grounds and a very hot signals between the preamps and the switcher.

Be interesting to see a diagram of this. It seems an unusual way to connect the preamps, and imo is not ideal. If it were me, I'd have a buffer/splitter like an Axess BS-2 splitting the guitar signal between the RM and Tri front ends.

Then you could use one loop (5-8) of the RG-16 to A/B the outputs of each preamp to whatever your next source point is (sounds like send switching only to post preamp effects?). You only need one loop to A/B two preamps. It has to be a full loop, like 5-8.

Assuming the config of the loops 5-8 are the same as a GCX, Axess GRX4 Loop #4 etc, one preamp's output will go into the loop's input, the other preamp's output into the loop's return, and the loop's output goes to the next source (unlike a GCX, I think the RJM configs to the input of the next loop along - the GCX, you have wire it). The loop's send is left unconnected. Switching the loop on/off A/B's the outputs of the preamps.

The RG-16 has relays, doesn't it? Relays are transparent. It doesn't matter who makes the switcher. There's something else going on in there.

Just my 2 cents.

Chris.
Click to expand...
Thanks Chris, as always I appreciate your deep knowledge :)
I think the my lack of knowledge and skill is likely the culprit.
 
yeah, so, I hadn't realized the RG-16 passes audio when the loops are off. I had expected no signal to pass. I understand why the "unaffected audio" pass is wanted if user is using amps with preAmp section. In my case, I want to switch between different preAmps and then feed the loops. I do have a couple other switchers, a GLab and a Masotti MXM. Looks like I need to rethink the whole thing.
 
The RG-16 is designed to switch pedals, so when the loop is off, the input signal is passed to the output, bypassing the pedal in the loop. When it's on, the input is sent to the loop's send and the loop's return is sent to the output.

If you're trying to use a loop to mute the signal, it would be better to do something like this:

From Front -> Triaxis input
Triaxis output -> Loop input
Loop send -> power amp input
 
rjmmusic said:
The RG-16 is designed to switch pedals, so when the loop is off, the input signal is passed to the output, bypassing the pedal in the loop. When it's on, the input is sent to the loop's send and the loop's return is sent to the output.

If you're trying to use a loop to mute the signal, it would be better to do something like this:

From Front -> Triaxis input
Triaxis output -> Loop input
Loop send -> power amp input
Click to expand...
Ron, thanks for this!
Showing me routing options I hadn't thought of, for example, patching a device in the routing between From Front source and loop returns; very helpful :)

I had been using the MXM down stream of RG-16 to mute all, which does work well.

What doesn't really work is guitar-> RG-16-> Power Amp

What I'm interested in achieving is the ability to switch between a few preAmps, rather than using just one. I should clarify, one preamp at a time. I know there are folks who like to combine preamps in the same signal, and that's not what I'm after.
 
Generally speaking, if you're just switching between preamps, you would just connect one preamp per loop, send to preamp in, return to preamp out and switch them as if they were effect pedals. You just have to make sure to only turn on one of those loops at a time.

The only caveat is that a high gain preamp could feed back in this configuration. In that case, you would use two loops per preamp to put more space between the input and output signals:

Loop 1 send to preamp input, preamp output to loop 2 return. Turn on loops 1 and & 2 at the same time. (You can substitute any pair of neighboring loops for 1&2 here). That will likely help with the feedback.
 
rjmmusic said:
Generally speaking, if you're just switching between preamps, you would just connect one preamp per loop, send to preamp in, return to preamp out and switch them as if they were effect pedals. You just have to make sure to only turn on one of those loops at a time.

The only caveat is that a high gain preamp could feed back in this configuration. In that case, you would use two loops per preamp to put more space between the input and output signals:

Loop 1 send to preamp input, preamp output to loop 2 return. Turn on loops 1 and & 2 at the same time. (You can substitute any pair of neighboring loops for 1&2 here). That will likely help with the feedback.
Click to expand...
this is exactly the way I was using the RG-16

I can foresee some other configs with the gear I have
 
ok, spent a good portion of the day getting my WDW rack rig patched back together
looks like most of my questions can be tracked down to user error

my TriAxis sounds pretty good...the electrical noise was the rhythm yellow channel...maybe there's something wrong with it...probably, but the other modes sound fabulous, so there is that

as far as my issues with RG-16, I have not yet tried high gain TriAxis or Rock Master returns on other RG-16 loops, I will check that out and report back

all I have to say is WDW sounds glorious :-D
 
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