Switching Mesa Mark V Channels by G System CC message

[bucketbot]

Is anyone using this method?
In theory I think it may be possible to assign 3 switches on the G to send midi CC messages to the amp Gizmo & use that to change channels on the amp.
The basic problem I see is that each press of the G sytem switch assigned to the CC number toggles between 0 & 127 so for that reason suspect it may not work as a CC value 0-63 on the Gizmo turns the switch off & 63-127 turns it on....... or is this automatically dealt with by putting the 3 switches on the amp gizmo assigned to the channels in a group?
The Mark V only has 2 switching Jacks for Channels 2 + 3. When both are ungrounded Channel 1 is engaged.

Lets say you use switches 2 + 3 on your amp gizmo to control channels 2 + 3 on your amp & control this by assigning Midi CC numbers to 3 of the switches on your G system for example CC's 88, 89 & 90 which are the default numbers for switches 1 -3 on the Gizmo.
You also put switches 1 to 3 in a group as they are controlling amp channels & obv you only want one active at a time.
I'm not sure how the custom cable works as at this time I have at present got neither it or an amp Gizmo hence the research before I buy so I can only try & explain by using my understanding of using the Switching jacks on the amp.
I propose plugging nothing into switch 1. The amp channel 2 jack connects to switch 2 & the amp channel 3 jack connects to switch 3.
Lets say we start with all the Amp Gizmo switches off so channel 1 would be engaged.
To engage channel 2 we press G system switch 2 which sends CC 89, value 127 engaging channel 2 on the amp. Great!
Similarly for Channel 3 by pressing G system switch 3 which sends CC 90, value 127 engaging channel 3 on the amp. Also Great!

Now comes the theory to select channel one we press G system switch 1 which sends CC 88 value 127, but because nothing is connected to that Gizmo switch & all 3 switches are in a group all that happens is switch 2 & 3 are broken hence Channel 1 is selected.
Great! All 3 channels selected! I'm guessing pressing this switch will always produce this result as it will always open the other 2 switches in the group?

All seems plausible to me so far......Now the problem. :?
I now want to select channel 2 again so by pressing switch 2 on the G system it will again send CC 89 but this time as value 0 as per the G system manual (which states each press of the switch toggles between 0 and 127) which will not turn the switch on which is what is required? :cry:

So what is the solution? I guess pressing the switch twice would work as on the second press a value of 127 would again be sent but then we are into tap dancing which rather defeats the object or maybe I am missing something obvious here? :?

Also one other possible plus point of using this method is that I assume that as the Amp Gizmo can receive both CC messages & Program change messages simultaneously in theory you could assign a channel to each patch by saving the amp gizmo switch assignment according to the PC message sent from the G System & also change channels within a patch using the CC method by pressing the 3 G system switches after setting them up as above...... if it works of course!

 

[bucketbot]

I have also heard that quite a few people have had problems with the Mark V amp cable & the Mini Gizmo?

Makes me think that I may be better off going with the Amp Gizmo rather than the Mini Gizmo & just using the TS jacks on the Mark V to switch channels, EQ & Solo? :?

 

[rjmmusic]

Unfortunately, the G-System is pretty limited as a MIDi controller. You're pretty much limited to using program changes, or you're going to be pressing controller buttons repeatedly to get things in sync (as you mention in your first post).

There are no problems that I'm aware with the Mark V cable and the Mini Amp Gizmo, at least not for two years or so. If you or anyone is experiencing any problems, please let us know and we'll get it fixed!

 

[bucketbot]

Unfortunately, the G-System is pretty limited as a MIDi controller. You're pretty much limited to using program changes, or you're going to be pressing controller buttons repeatedly to get things in sync (as you mention in your first post).

There are no problems that I'm aware with the Mark V cable and the Mini Amp Gizmo, at least not for two years or so. If you or anyone is experiencing any problems, please let us know and we'll get it fixed!

Thanks Ron,
I still think that doing what I am suggesting should be basically possible albeit with a few more button presses & would be a useful way of using the G system in addition to selecting channels on a "by patch" basis using Program Changes.

Can you at least confirm that the theory I am applying regarding the group mode is correct with reference to the statement below?

"Now comes the theory to select channel one we press G system switch 1 which sends CC 88 value 127, but because nothing is connected to that Gizmo switch & all 3 switches are in a group all that happens is switch 2 & 3 are broken hence Channel 1 is selected."

 

[bucketbot]

Unfortunately, the G-System is pretty limited as a MIDi controller. You're pretty much limited to using program changes, or you're going to be pressing controller buttons repeatedly to get things in sync (as you mention in your first post).

There are no problems that I'm aware with the Mark V cable and the Mini Amp Gizmo, at least not for two years or so. If you or anyone is experiencing any problems, please let us know and we'll get it fixed!

Thanks Ron,
I still think that doing what I am suggesting should be basically possible albeit with a few more button presses & would be a useful way of using the G system to change amp channels within a patch in addition to selecting channels on a "by patch" basis using Program Changes.

Can you at least confirm that the theory I am applying regarding the group mode is correct with reference to the statement below?

"Now comes the theory to select channel one we press G system switch 1 which sends CC 88 value 127, but because nothing is connected to that Gizmo switch & all 3 switches are in a group all that happens is switch 2 & 3 are broken hence Channel 1 is selected."

 

[rjmmusic]

Unfortunately, the G-System is pretty limited as a MIDi controller. You're pretty much limited to using program changes, or you're going to be pressing controller buttons repeatedly to get things in sync (as you mention in your first post).

There are no problems that I'm aware with the Mark V cable and the Mini Amp Gizmo, at least not for two years or so. If you or anyone is experiencing any problems, please let us know and we'll get it fixed!

Thanks Ron,
I still think that doing what I am suggesting should be basically possible albeit with a few more button presses & would be a useful way of using the G system in addition to selecting channels on a "by patch" basis using Program Changes.

Can you at least confirm that the theory I am applying regarding the group mode is correct with reference to the statement below?

"Now comes the theory to select channel one we press G system switch 1 which sends CC 88 value 127, but because nothing is connected to that Gizmo switch & all 3 switches are in a group all that happens is switch 2 & 3 are broken hence Channel 1 is selected."

Yes, that's how it will work.

 

[bucketbot]

Thanks Ron.

Plan to purchase the Amp Gizmo & the cable as soon as the UK dealer has stock. :mrgreen:

He tells me that you are having some supply problems though so hope it won't be too long.
Then I look forward to experimenting with it & will post my results.

 

[bucketbot]

In case you guys are interested this is what I am currently putting together. :mrgreen:

After further research & some advice from Ron I decided the Mini Gizmo will meet my needs rather than it's big Brother.

 

[bucketbot]

I have now tried this & it works a treat!!
It works best if you set the 3 G system switches to Hold rather than Toggle then assign the relevant CC number to each switch which for me as I used the default on the Amp Gizmo was:
88 for CHN 1.
89 for CHN 2.
90 for CHN 3.

When you do this it is not necessary to double tap any of the switches & a single press will engage the relevant channel from within a patch & disengage the previous channel (Of course all 3 must be grouped on the Amp Gizmo) & the Light around the G System Switch comes on only momentarily then stays off.

Assigning another switch to toggle mode with CC 93 turns the Solo function on & off with each press. :mrgreen:
You could of course do the same for any of the 8 switchable functions on the footswitch as long as you have the RJM custom cable. :mrgreen:

 

[bucketbot]

Further to above I just spent the morning putting it all together.
Must say it has turned out better than I could have hoped.
Even before with my existing setup with the 2 X100B’s in stereo I was getting good results with the G System so I feared that introducing a third head into the mix may cause all sorts of problems....Not so!
I modified my G System Global setup slightly as the Lehle D Loop has as buffer incorporated which according to Lehle is the same as the one on the Lehle Sunday Driver, so as some others on the G Forum who are using this with the G System have done I have reduced my G System Input Gain to 0db & just dialled a slight increase in with the buffer. Everything else on the G System is set at zero attenuation for best SNR.

Even the X100B’s sound better now & I am getting no tone loss that I can detect from any of the 5 channels that I now have.
I have my Wampler Buffer up on eBay as I no longer need it. The only place I needed an Ebtech was at the Slave out on the Mark V, making the connections one at a time that was the only place I started to get hum but the Ebtech got rid of it so I now have almost no hum even on the High Gain channels.
Because the Lehle D Loop AB switch has all 6 of its Jacks wired as stereo it allows me to take advantage of the balanced features of the G System insert loop for BOTH preamps.
I am using balanced cables for everything apart from a short TS cable between the Mark V Slave out & the Ebtech.
The D loop switches by midi between the 2 preamps flawlessly with no delays or popping.
This can be done patch by patch or within a patch using the 2 buttons on the D Loop which can be assigned with any combination of Loop A, B & the Buffer on or off.

I also have the Mark V set to hard bypass of the loop as I am not using it anyway & using the Slave out into the G system insert loop via the Lehle Dual Switch to give me both the pre & power amp sections of the Mark V into the G System.
This sounds so much better to me, the only downside is it bypasses the Master Volume so you have to set your volume with the individual Channel masters. In a way this makes things easier as it's simpler to balance the volume of the Dry Mark V with the 2 Wet X100B's.
Also it bypasses the Solo Function on the Mark V but to be honest I don’t really need that as kicking in my modded SD-1 works great for pushing the font end of either preamp a bit more, plus that frees up another switch on the G system.
Switched to Variac mode down to 10W the Mark V even sounds awesome at Low Volumes.

Even the wiring is a breeze to setup as I have only 2 cables running from the G system; an 8 way cable snake & the Amp Gizmo Mark V custom cable & I have everything labelled with dymo tape.

I am also managing to power my mini Amp Gizmo just fine from the G system power outputs. So I only have the G System plug & a power supply for the Lehle on the pedal board Happy Days!! :mrgreen:

:mrgreen: